Talking about difficult topics like gender, race, sexual orientation, and class can raise anxiety for many people, and yet we must have the conversation in our schools and our lives in order to be more inclusive and change the world for the better. What are the fears and common pitfalls that keep us from broaching courageous conversations? Gain practical skills for facilitating as well as participating in the conversation.

1. Sayre School
Rosetta Eun Ryong Lee
Seattle Girls’ School
Train the Trainer:
Interrupting with Care and
Facilitating Courageous Conversations
Rosetta Eun Ryong Lee (http://tiny.cc/rosettalee)

2. About Seattle Girls’ School
Rosetta Eun Ryong Lee (http://tiny.cc/rosettalee)

3. Agenda
 Courageous Conversations
 Fears and Obstacles
 Interruption Skills
 Facilitation skills
 Practice Makes…
 Discussion time
 Wrap up
Rosetta Eun Ryong Lee (http://tiny.cc/rosettalee)

4. Courageous Conversations
in Our Schools and Lives
Rosetta Eun Ryong Lee (http://tiny.cc/rosettalee)

5. Fears and Anxieties that Keep Us
from Having Conversations
 Offending
 Losing Face
 Tokenism
 Professional Risk
 Bursting the Bubble
 Rocking the Boat
 Conflict
 Lack of “Authority”
Rosetta Eun Ryong Lee (http://tiny.cc/rosettalee)

6. Pitfalls and Obstacles that Keep Us
from Conversing Again
 Outbursts
 Silence
 Denial
 The Good Talk
 Teacher vs. Facilitator
 Personal Attacks
 The Quick Fix
 Leadership Oppression
Rosetta Eun Ryong Lee (http://tiny.cc/rosettalee)

7. Open Acknowledgment
Rosetta Eun Ryong Lee (http://tiny.cc/rosettalee)

8. Define the Opportunity
Rosetta Eun Ryong Lee (http://tiny.cc/rosettalee)

9. NCBI Effective Interventions Model
 Reduce Defensiveness
– Tone
– Body Language
– Respect
 Keep the Conversation Going
– Hear Them Out
– Ask Open-Ended Questions
– Set Aside Your Feeling for the Moment
– Dialogue
 Build the Relationship
 Win an Ally
Rosetta Eun Ryong Lee (http://tiny.cc/rosettalee)

10. Everything You Ever Wanted to Interrupt
But Didn’t Know How To…
 Think of trigger events of phrases
 Which ones have proven most challenging?
 Which ones would you like to strategize effective
interventions for?
 Strategize for different people: strangers,
acquaintances, friends, family members,
children, etc.
Rosetta Eun Ryong Lee (http://tiny.cc/rosettalee)

11. Practice Makes…
Please work in pairs:
-Feed the trigger phrase
-Respond
-Feedback
-Try Again
-Repeat
Rosetta Eun Ryong Lee (http://tiny.cc/rosettalee)

12. Sharing the Wisdom
Rosetta Eun Ryong Lee (http://tiny.cc/rosettalee)

13. Facilitation Skills
 Space
 Confidence and Competence
 Relationship Building
 Credibility
 Flexibility and Authority
 Optimism
 Modeling
 Multiple Learning Styles
Rosetta Eun Ryong Lee (http://tiny.cc/rosettalee)

14. Facilitation Tips
 Co-facilitation
 Depersonalization
 Vulnerability
 Relationships
 Saving it for Later
 Discomfort
 Clarification
 Listening
 Hot Buttons
Rosetta Eun Ryong Lee (http://tiny.cc/rosettalee)

15. Avoiding the Pitfalls and
Overcoming the Obstacles
 Powerful stories
 Powerful statistics
 Powerful analogies
 Facilitation Skills
 Welcoming environment
 Clear and strict norms
 Willingness to sit with
discomfort
Rosetta Eun Ryong Lee (http://tiny.cc/rosettalee)

16. Equality versus Equity
Everybody gets a shirt versus everybody
gets a shirt that fits.
Giving everybody some insulin in
equality. Giving only people who are
diabetic some insulin is equity.
What is “fair”?
Rosetta Eun Ryong Lee (http://tiny.cc/rosettalee)

17. Conflation of Individual/Institutional
Rosetta Eun Ryong Lee (http://tiny.cc/rosettalee)

18. Correlation versus Causation
Correlation: When income is averaged and compared, there
is a strong correlation between gender and income. This is
due to a myriad of historical, systemic, and economic factors that
impact men and women differently in the workplace.
Causation: When income is averaged and compared, there is a
strong correlation between gender and income. This must be
because women must not be as smart, hard-working, or
good with money as men.
Correlation: When more firefighters are fighting a fire, the
bigger the fire is observed to be.
Causation: The additional firefighters made the fire bigger.
Rosetta Eun Ryong Lee (http://tiny.cc/rosettalee)

19. Accumulated Advantages
Rosetta Eun Ryong Lee (http://tiny.cc/rosettalee)

20. Privilege
“Privilege exists when one group has
something of value that is denied to others
simply because of the groups they belong
to, rather than because of anything they’ve
done or failed to do.”
[as described by Peggy McIntosh and quoted by Allan Johnson]
Privilege is SYSTEMIC. It drives the
systems that dominate our societies.
Rosetta Eun Ryong Lee (http://tiny.cc/rosettalee)

21. Situational Advantage
There are prime parking spots and seats
reserved for people with disabilities. People
with disabilities are often first to board
planes and other transportation vehicles.
These advantages are situational and do not
balance out systemic oppression.
Rosetta Eun Ryong Lee (http://tiny.cc/rosettalee)

22. Safety versus Comfort
Safety: I feel that, in this space, I can ask questions without
fear of judgment. I can voice my perspective and know that
I will be validated for the fact that that is my truth. Others
may challenge my ideas, but that challenge is in the spirit of
greater shared understanding and growth.
Comfort: I feel that, in this space, my reality will be agreed
with, validated, and unchallenged. I don’t have to explain
myself to be understood, and I don’t have to justify my
perspective, as everyone shares it.
As educators, we are constantly setting up an environment
where students are safe but not always comfortable...
SO THAT THEY CAN LEARN AND GROW.
Rosetta Eun Ryong Lee (http://tiny.cc/rosettalee)

23. Practice Makes…
Less Heart-Attack-Inducing
Rosetta Eun Ryong Lee (http://tiny.cc/rosettalee)

24. Structure
 Groups of 6
– Facilitator
– Note Taker
– 2 Participants
– 2 “Challenge” Roles
 7 Minute Discussions
 Critical Friends Style Feedback
Rosetta Eun Ryong Lee (http://tiny.cc/rosettalee)

25. Goals to Strive For
 Be Real
 Don’t End Early
 Don’t “Admire the Problem”
 Sit With All the Feelings
 Support the Facilitator
Rosetta Eun Ryong Lee (http://tiny.cc/rosettalee)

26. Round Two Discussion Time
Round Two
Discussion
Round Two
Feedback and
Discussion
Discussion: Should schools revamp the
curriculum to include multiple diversity
perspectives even if there is little to no
diversity of that sort in the student or
faculty/staff population?
Rosetta Eun Ryong Lee (http://tiny.cc/rosettalee)

27. Round One Discussion Time
Round One
Discussion
Round One
Feedback and
Discussion
Discussion: Many schools struggle to have
many students and faculty members of
color because there “aren’t enough strong
candidates of color.” What do you think?
Rosetta Eun Ryong Lee (http://tiny.cc/rosettalee)

28. Round Three Discussion Time
Round Two
Discussion
Round Two
Feedback and
Discussion
Discussion: What is the role of men and
women in the work toward gender equity
and social justice?
Rosetta Eun Ryong Lee (http://tiny.cc/rosettalee)

29. Large Group Share
What were some:
Ah-ha moments
Great strategies
Heads up
Questions or Concerns
Rosetta Eun Ryong Lee (http://tiny.cc/rosettalee)

30. Next Steps
 Attend more Train the Trainer workshops
 Have more real discussions with people
who affirm you
 Have more real one-on-one dialogue with
people who may or may not affirm you
 Continue to learn and grow in your
knowledge base for content AND skills
Rosetta Eun Ryong Lee (http://tiny.cc/rosettalee)

31. Final Questions or Comments?
Rosetta Eun Ryong Lee (http://tiny.cc/rosettalee)

32. Resources
• Anti-Defamation League
• Cross Cultural Connections
(www.CulturesConnecting.com)
• Facilitation First
• Jimpact Enterprises, Inc.
• National Coalition Building Institute
• The People’s Institute
• Stirfry Seminars
• The Thiagi Group
Rosetta Eun Ryong Lee (http://tiny.cc/rosettalee)

33. Presenter Information
Rosetta Eun Ryong Lee
6th Faculty and
Professional Outreach
Seattle Girls’ School
2706 S Jackson Street
Seattle WA 98144
(206) 805-6562
rlee@seattlegirlsschool.org
http://tiny.cc/rosettalee
Rosetta Eun Ryong Lee (http://tiny.cc/rosettalee)